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Feedback Wanted: Site Conflict Adjustments (3.2)

Luka Patajac

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Ok so while healing rate will not change time to heal building will change based on amount of builds holder of builds has?
 

Hardwell

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The table on the very right shows how fast your drain compared to how long it takes to repair a building from 0 to full HP.
:v you said time but you used % to depict time e.e how are we supposed to read the chart with that unit, shouldn't it be in mins
 

Alewx

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Ok so while healing rate will not change time to heal building will change based on amount of builds holder of builds has?
No, the repairrate is fixed, so it will always take the same time no matter how many buildings there are, but the time will obviously be different because the HP will change when upgrading, so an excellent building always takes double the time to repair than a basic one.
 

Luka Patajac

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So amount of time taken to heal building will change based on yield(because higher yield mans more HP)?
 

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No, the repairrate is fixed, so it will always take the same time no matter how many buildings there are, but the time will obviously be different because the HP will change when upgrading, so an excellent building always takes double the time to repair than a basic one.
Good that it's no longer a punishment to upgrade yield, however I feel that there is no factor motivating people to heal their gates. Presuming most clan are about to be less reliant on ally, clan need some sort of good healing power to sustain in conflict phase.

Could we have when gate is orange/triangle shape (invulnerable) status we get bonus heal of 25 before the attackers come and red it which then heal 20 again.
 

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Could we have when gate is orange/triangle shape (invulnerable) status we get bonus heal of 25 before the attackers come and red it which then heal 20 again.
Before a building gets attacked, there is no need to repair it?
 

Luka Patajac

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Could we have when gate is orange/triangle shape (invulnerable) status we get bonus heal of 25 before the attackers come and red it which then heal 20 again.
So you mean heal bonus whenever gate is "yellow" or when gate has gone back to "yellow"(it was red but it's attacker didn't come back so it became yellow again)?
 

Hardwell

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So you mean heal bonus whenever gate is "yellow" or when gate has gone back to "yellow"(it was red but it attacker didn't come back so it became yellow again)?
Gone back to yellow
 

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Before a building gets attacked, there is no need to repair it?
Hmm the bonus repair comes in during middle of attack when the tower switches from red to yellow again the bonus repair comes in
 

xx-predator-xx

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Seeing specific people on this thread asking for sites to be drained in a minute or two because they're outnumbered is ridiculous. Especially EU1 kos who aren't logging online during any phase or even during protection phase to prepare themselves for an attack, you can't expect anything if you're not even trying, at first you were able to take 400% sites because of the 2 minutes draining now you're not even able to take 200% sites which is also only 4 minutes draining, I mean you're not trying to. Last attack which 7 kos were online in, you took the last 400% yield claim on EU1 and that was 2 days ago, since then you're offline. What are you trying to excuse yourself for, defenders are always gonna outnumber attackers and that's a fact on almost every server you're gonna play on, nothing will change this unless the alliance falls apart which is most likely not gonna happen like this, just like how defenders have formed an alliance, attackers can form their alliance and organize their attacks together, nothing stops anyone from doing so
lemme me put it straight for you to comprehend. this update should destroy alliances. which it doesn't and this leaves the players attacking in a horrific disadvantage. a disadvantage which you didn't encountered when you hopped from clan to clan before the new "update" :p
 

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@Highway as you specified this update is ment to "destroy" or to make alliances useless. Can you please provide us with further details since nothing happened? (check europe_1) for example.
 

Alewx

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however I feel that there is no factor motivating people to heal their gates. Presuming most clan are about to be less reliant on ally, clan need some sort of good healing power to sustain in conflict phase.
The chance of losing the building is not motivating to repair it and keep attackers off?
 

Hardwell

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The chance of losing the building is not motivating to repair it and keep attackers off?
That's not what I mean.... I mean the new update will make kos strong in drain and make ally 4x less useful which is dampening on any clan. There needs to be some sort of mechanics to create tiny little help for individual clans.
 

Alewx

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That's not what I mean.... I mean the new update will make kos strong in drain and make ally 4x less useful which is dampening on any clan. There needs to be some sort of mechanics to create tiny little help for individual clans.
Could you create a very specific case for it? I think I still don't really get the point, why it would be extra needed.
 

Hardwell

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Could you create a very specific case for it? I think I still don't really get the point, why it would be extra needed.
well its perspective wise. Personally during battle I'll hope to protect the tower and have that excitement for it to be yellow as soon as possible for bonus healing something to look forward to instead of constant 20 heal which look stagnant. And zoning the enemy from entering radius to make it red also create some sort of strategic fight instead of just fighting around the tower.

Defender will now have to find ways to create blockade from the drainers entering the radius which create a dynamic and tactical fight.
 

Alewx

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well its perspective wise. Personally during battle I'll hope to protect the tower and have that excitement for it to be yellow as soon as possible for bonus healing something to look forward to instead of constant 20 heal which look stagnant. And zoning the enemy from entering radius to make it red also create some sort of strategic fight instead of just fighting around the tower.

Defender will now have to find ways to create blockade from the drainers entering the radius which create a dynamic and tactical fight.
Ok now i get where you are comming from, and understand the desire for a boost during conflict and non attacked times.
But i'm just not sure about it.
 

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Take your time to thing to read the aspects here carefully and try to think how it will affect your server/clan etc. :geek:
Again it would be great to get your feedback, questions here so this final draft can be fine tuned before it goes live.
Based on current dynamics on multiple servers, I don't see how this would improve the gameplay for small independent attacking clans. In fact, I believe that this is going to make their situation even worse.

First, let's discuss how the game currently plays out. You have a server with a low-to-medium activity in the Town hall, so only about a half of each map is opened for players to hold. 5 allied clans control the server - each agreed to own 1 map and thus share the fame pool evenly between the allies. During conflict phases, when they feel in danger (high chance of an attack by other clans) they begin to exchange their sites (for example: the clan holding sites in MW will drain GV, and the clan with sites in GV will drain MW). The attackers have 16-8 minutes (either basic or good yield) to stop their exchange, kill the players and drain the site more, thus taking it for themselves.

Now, how is this going to change after the update?
Introduce a variable drain speed for sites depending on how many sites the clan currently owns vs the opponent owned sites. It should make takeovers and defending easier if the owned buildings diverge greatly between involved clans.
  • Drain rate will increase for the attacker if the clan has less sites than the site owner clan.
  • Drain rate will decrease for the attacker if the clan has more sites than the site owner clan.
This might seem like a solution to exchanging sites between the allied clans at first, but what is stopping them from reaching a different agreement? During the first phase clan A will hold MW and GV and on the second phase it will swap with clan B that had 0 sites during the first phase. This will be much easier on smaller servers, as there aren't that many sites that need to be swapped. If the clan can bring online enough players (or multi-accounts!) to cover all sites, it will be much more difficult to interrupt the exchange and take some sites as there will only be a 2 minute window to do so.

  • Drain rate will dynamically change during conflict as site are getting reclaimed
All sites are going to get attacked at the exact same time by the allied clans, right at the begining of the Vulnerable phase. Which means that all sites will change ownership within the first 2 minutes and the phase will essentially be over. If some miss their queue to attack by a couple seconds it won't change much, as the site would then be left as the last one to drain with less than 10% hp left.

Adrenaline Buffed
  • Getting Attacker or Defender of a site grants an “Adrenaline” buff to the player, that will run for 10 seconds and gets re-applied before it expires automatically as long as the player is an active defender/attacker in the building radius
  • “Adrenaline” Buff gives:
    • “Defender Adrenaline” for defenders
      • 4x incoming damage reduction from all PVP players that don't have the
        “Attacker Adrenaline” buff
    • “Attacker Adrenaline” for attackers
      • 4x incoming damage reduction from all PVP players that don't have the
        “Defender Adrenaline” buff
    • When attacker and defender fighting against each other should be able to play as usual, but side clans will have a debuff with it.
And now, not only are the allied clans able to exchange sites in 2 minutes, they will also take no damage while being attacked by other players that want to take the site. This means that the allied clan can literally leave multiple AFK brachis (that can be multi-accounts!) spread around the map on each site to drain while remaining almost unkillable. We can assume that in most situations, the allied clans will start the drain before others (or they will kill the opponents before the phase starts with their active accounts, while the AFK brachi multi-accounts remain in their positions)

Now it is important to note that not all servers behave like this. There are servers where we can observe defence attempts from clans without the need for an exchange. But can we be sure that this will not change after the update? The players have adapted this strategy for a reason. If attacking sites is much easier than defending them and claimed sites cannot change their owner until the next Vulnerable phase, the logical conclusion is to attack your own sites. In many situations it is almost impossible to defend a site and players do not want to risk losing it. They see much more benefit in stopping others from accesing the fame that sites generate than trying to risk upgrading sites only to lose them to attackers.

Hard to predict if large servers could adapt this strategy as well. Does each clan have the manpower to cover 26 sites (2 maps)? Or could they split in multiple clans that would take turns in the exchange? Only time would tell how the update would really play out.
 

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The allies can never have the same drain speed as other clans that do not own anything, therefore the other clans can jump in and just render the agreements void because oh too bad we just took your buildings a lot quicker than you.
 

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The allies can never have the same drain speed as other clans that do not own anything, therefore the other clans can jump in and just render the agreements void because oh too bad we just took your buildings a lot quicker than you.
This might seem like a solution to exchanging sites between the allied clans at first, but what is stopping them from reaching a different agreement? During the first phase clan A will hold MW and GV and on the second phase it will swap with clan B that had 0 sites during the first phase.
1/2 of the ally stays without sites for 1 Vulnerable phase, during the next phase the allied clans without sites (the second half of the ally) attack (all at the same time) and exchange the maps. The first half loses all sites and so they attack on the next Vulnerable phase, the cycle repeats for each phase.
 

Alewx

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1/2 of the ally stays without sites for 1 Vulnerable phase, during the next phase the allied clans without sites (the second half of the ally) attack (all at the same time) and exchange the maps. The first half loses all sites and so they attack on the next Vulnerable phase, the cycle repeats for each phase.
I have the impression, you just update your scenario that is just meant to be, noone else will ever have a chance, to what ever we say.
 

Czarna

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I have the impression, you just update your scenario that is just meant to be, noone else will ever have a chance, to what ever we say.
I don't think that the scenario I talked about is too far-fetched. If players are already doing exchanges, what is stopping them from taking it further after the update? Depending on the server (I am active on multiple servers, with varying intensity), I am both part of large defending alliances and small independent clans, which is why I leave my feedback here. I don't want the gameplay to remain so dull and focused around mining ores as it is currently in my honest impression.
 

Alewx

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I don't think that the scenario I talked about is too far-fetched. If players are already doing exchanges, what is stopping them from taking it further after the update? Depending on the server (I am active on multiple servers, with varying intensity), I am both part of large defending alliances and small independent clans, which is why I leave my feedback here. I don't want the gameplay to remain so dull and focused around mining ores as it is currently in my honest impression.
But what would solve it in such a case; there is an alliance that consists of 50% owning clans and 50% non owning clans, that just switch, what would distingish them from other non alliance clans?
 

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Usually trading buildings has the following downsides:
- Dont get the Item Production boost when DV takes the site when holding the site as long as possible. On an excellent site this is a huge fame boost that is lost.
- Invested clan dollars for the yield upgrades are not used at its full potential
- lame gameplay for every clan ;)
 

Czarna

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But what would solve it in such a case; there is an alliance that consists of 50% owning clans and 50% non owning clans, that just switch, what would distingish them from other non alliance clans?
I don't think we have anything in the game currently that would allow to easily distinguish between the attack of an un-allied clan and an ally clan. Implementing an alliance system might not work either, as clans could easily choose not to join it (unless there were some benefits, but then we would be creating a new set of problems). So the best approach would probably be to find a way to discourage that behavior.

Usually trading buildings has the following downsides:
- Dont get the Item Production boost when DV takes the site when holding the site as long as possible. On an excellent site this is a huge fame boost that is lost.
- Invested clan dollars for the yield upgrades are not used at its full potential
- lame gameplay for every clan ;)
Wish you were present during the last few days on Asia server, the clans that currently own all the sites, kept exchanging them until the attacking force lost a lot of motivation (which means that now they can upgrade yields more freely). But I am worried that clans may decide to not upgrade their yields (thus no dds wasted) and keep exchanging, purely to limit their opponents' ability to participate in the elections. It is very dull I agree, but to some degree it is already happening.

Dropping this topic for a moment - I don't think that the ability to drain sites in 2 minutes is very fun either. I enjoy large clan fights that take a long time, but I do understand that it may create some issues, and many clans simply do not have the man power to participate in such wars while making an impact. Above everything, the game should be fun to play. But the 2 minute timer is definitely much better than the one previously proposed in the other thread.
 

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Usually trading buildings has the following downsides:
- Dont get the Item Production boost when DV takes the site when holding the site as long as possible. On an excellent site this is a huge fame boost that is lost.
- Invested clan dollars for the yield upgrades are not used at its full potential
- lame gameplay for every clan ;)
but that is the gameplay that is being done on most servers, because it is very complicated to defend and that is the point if you have many towers, but it is more complicated since this can only have a maximum of 5 towers

the point of view to improve:

The repair rate should be raised, the more improved the tower is, the better the repair should be, given that Dds is invested all the time and they drain a tower that cost 83k in 2/3min. It bothers a little that it is unfair like that manner

The other point is the improvement of adrenaline, the attackers will take advantage of this in the following way:

Since it had already been nerfed, the Full Defense dinos (brachys) with that defense improvement do not even need to fight to get the tower, they only need to resist

How to improve: the defenders do not need x4 defense because if they have towers it means that they should already resist. I consider that they need x4 attack improvement to equal those that come with full defense dinos :geek:
 

Hardwell

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Ok now i get where you are comming from, and understand the desire for a boost during conflict and non attacked times.
But i'm just not sure about it.
Well you can ask the community for a poll
 

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I believe any clan/player that attacks can gain the "attacker" buff but only holder of building that is attacked can get "defender" buff
wouldnt it be easy for allied clans to just join the attack too and get the same buff against attackers?
 

Hardwell

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wouldnt it be easy for allied clans to just join the attack too and get the same buff against attackers?
But they will also contribute in draining down the towers isn't it helping drainer too 😂😂
 
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